SLAP
Ace
Wingman
Master of Strategery
Exam Ready
Forum Replies Created
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Although it would be bad etiquette to leave the squadron that hired you early in your career (e.g. within the first few years after pilot training), it is not uncommon for people to transfer to different squadrons/aircraft within the Guard/Reserve.
A couple rules of thumb:
1. Once a fighter pilot in any jet, you are qualified to transfer to any other fighter OR non-fighter aircraft (except helicopters).
2. Any non-fighter pilot can transfer to other non-fighter communities, but it is nearly impossible to transfer from non-fighters to fighters.
3. The period between earning your wings and the 10th year of service makes you uniquely marketable – especially if transferring to a new squadron that flies that same aircraft. Why? Unlike a UPT hire, you pose no risk of washing out since you already have your wings and can contribute much sooner than hiring another person off the street. And Guard/Reserve squadrons can’t start pulling in experienced active duty pilots until their 10-year commitment is up.So, you don’t want to transfer too early because you may burn some bridges with the squadron that hired you, and you don’t want to transfer too late because you’ll have more competition with your active duty peers after their 10-year commitment is up. Between years 4-8 after earning your wings is probably the sweet spot.
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I can’t find the official documentation, but beyond just overall height will be your anthropometric measurements (butt to knee length, butt to top of head, etc). For any ejection aircraft, they need to make sure your legs won’t get ripped off or that your head won’t break through the canopy before the seat does. The standards must be slightly different from aircraft to aircraft because I know of at least one person selected for A-10s who was told that he could only get a waiver to fly the F-35 (not necessarily a bigger cockpit, just a different ejection seat).
As far as an official source to talk to, I would recommend connecting with one of the BogiDope Flight Docs, who should be able to track down the official standards that Wright Patt uses during your initial Flying Class 1 physical.
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As a pilot, there aren’t going to be many major differences:
1. Aircraft types: Same
2. Pilot training: Same
3. Pay/Benefits: Same
4. Part-time and Full-time opportunities: Same, although some differences in the types of orders.
5. Missions: 90% the same. The ANG controls most of the Alert missions around the country (there are a few AFR squadrons that do alert, but it’s rare)
6. Deployments: Airframe dependent, but in the fighter world it seems like most ANG squadrons deploy for 3 months at a time while AFR are more in line with active duty (6 months). That’s not written in stone though, just my observation. Probably different in other flying communities. -
Have you taken the AFOQT or TBAS yet? If not, I would focus on knocking those out of the park. Scores in the 90’s plus an instrument rating and fire medic experience will make your application very competitive.
If you’re focusing on Guard/Reserve squadrons, you likely won’t need to talk to a recruiter. The BogiDope job board is connected to MilRecruiter, where most Guard/Reserve squadrons post their UPT openings. You will just apply directly to the squadron using the application instructions they post. Rarely will need to deal with a recruiter. It’s a different story if you’re trying to apply to active duty.
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@siouxplt 25 yr old at Delta? Man, how times have changed!
Going on Military Leave for a few years early in your Delta career to do some tactical flying in the Guard/Reserve while your seniority continues to grow is a brilliant way to maximize the benefits of both careers. If we could outline the perfect path to take for everyone that came to BogiDope, this would be it!
Good luck and let us know how we can help.
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@goonie It sounds like you discovered what many USAFA grads won’t understand until day one of UPT — the Guard/Reserve provides significantly more control over your career (location, aircraft, civilian opportunities, etc). The Academy provides a world-class education, but it won’t be easy finding many advantages to going the USAFA route vs Guard/Reserve if you want to fly fighters.
That’s how BogiDope started. Guard/Reserve flying gigs were the best kept secret in military aviation, so we wanted more people to know it was a better path to arrive at the same destination.
Welcome to BogiDope!
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@Legs Use this as a general hieracrchy for chosing which degree to choose for maximizing your pilot applications:
1. Whichever gets you the highest GPA (generally speaking, it looks better on an application to have a 3.5GPA in business than a 2.5GPA in Mechanical Engineering — that might not be fair, but it’s the truth).
2. What gets you done the quickest? You can’t be an Air Force pilot without a degree, so the longer it takes, the less competitive you become.
3. Something that gives you flight time. Why? Because it directly increases your chances of success at UPT and will directly help you with several other sections of your application.
4. What do you want to do if you’re not selected? Even if you do get selected, the Guard/Reserve is traditionally a part-time gig, so what other career field interests you?Hope that helps! Let us know what you choose.
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@IHC_Nole Thanks for the kind words and welcome to BogiDope! Does the “Nole” in your username represent FSU??
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@Brian-Ellis Welcome to BogiDope and thanks for sharing your wisdom with the community!
For anyone interested in becoming a Warrant Officer in the Army and/or flying for Army Spec Ops, Brian is a very valuable resource!🍻
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@Fish Welcome to BogiDope! It sounds like you’re already way ahead of the game, but I would recommend that IF you decide to enlist, you do it in the Guard or Reserve WHILE going to college instead of active duty. You can typically get your tuition paid for, and it maximizes your ability to finish college and flight training on a normal(ish) timeline. Active duty will be considerably more demanding of your time which will likely delay your ability to complete the requirements to apply for UPT (if that’s your goal). Just my $.02.
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@Ckai Good luck with your upcoming AFOQT/TBAS retakes! As you probably already know, the Air Force recently changed the scoring system for both tests to a “super score” method, meaning your score can only increase, never decrease. So, find the specific sections that you need to improve and really concentrate on those instead of worrying about the whole thing again. Let us know how it goes!
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@WAZ What type of flying did/does your dad do for NASA?
As impressive as your engineering/NASA backgroud is, realize that your lack of PPL will hurt you with your PCSM score as well as your general competitiveness against other applicants for Guard/Reserve fighter slots. I recommend knocking that out ASAP.
Don’t feel obligated to go through a recruiter to get your AFOQT/TBAS scheduled. Call any local Air Force Base’s (Guard, Reserve, or Active Duty) education/testing/training departments (they have different names based on the base). If you can’t find a direct number, look up the base’s “Command Post” and they can transfer you. The other option would be to call any AFROTC detachments at colleges in your area.
It’s amazing how difficult the Air Force can sometimes make tracking these test taking opportunities down, but until something changes (don’t hold your breath) it’s on you to make as many calls as needed to find someone in your local area who can help. Good luck and welcome to BogiDope!
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@Fog Congrats on your solo, and good luck wrapping up your PPL!
Most squadrons will accept UPT applications within 6-12 months of graduation, so you don’t need to wait to apply until you actually have a degree in hand. The point is, if you’re inside a year until graduation, start sending those apps in ASAP. Good luck and welcome to BogiDope!
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@load It sounds like you’re checking a lot of boxes for most squadrons (flight time, military experience, good scores, etc). What do you think has been your biggest obstacle to getting hired up to this point?
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@FuzzyBear Welcome to BogiDope! I’m sure there are a few people on here interested in flying gliders, so you can be our resident glider expert.
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@Smallzz Impressive amount of flight experience at such a young age! We’ve worked with a few people who were able to build their flight time quickly enough to get hired at a major airline before starting UPT. Then their seniority grows at the airlines as they get to spend several years focusing on the military. When they eventually go part-time after training, they’ll go back to the airlines with way better pay, schedule, flexibility, etc. Might be something worth shooting for if you’re interested in both careers.
Are you in school? You can get hired at an airline these days without a college degree, but the Air Force will still require one. An Army Warrant Officer would be your only option to fly in the military without a degree that I’m aware of.
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@Jag Welcome to BogiDope! I got bit by the aviation bug a little later than some too, so it’s definitely not too late to make that dream into a reality.
Let us know how we can help. Good luck!
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@jared-johnson Impressive background minus one major red flag – you went to UF 🤮 (I’m an FSU guy)!
What kind of missions do you do as an Army diver?
Welcome to BogiDope!
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@KGQ Congrats on the Navy pilot slot! Not a bad backup option if the Guard/Reserve gig doesn’t pan out quickly enough.
What’s your deadline for being selected before you’re committed to the Navy? Your resume and test scores are great, but you definitely need a least some flight time to display an aptitude/interest in flying. Apply to as many squadrons as you can, regardless of flight time, since you’re on a tight timeline, but see if you can get to at least solo (ideally a PPL) as quickly as possible. Worst case scenario, it’ll help prepare you for Navy flight school.
Also, if there’s any info on the Merchant Marine Academy pipeline you can provide in a different thread someday, that would be great. As you know, it’s an often overlooked option for many.
Welcome to BogiDope!
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@TStephens34 Nothing faster than a winter preflight walkaround in Grand Forks. Great school.
Congrats on the AFRC slot! There’s a trend developing on this welcome board. AFRC is doing a great job of stealing AFROTC cadets away from active duty (Equivalent of the college sports transfer portal in military recruiting!). That’s awesome.
Any specific airframes or locations you’re focuing on?
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@Kyle Apparently the secret is out on the AFROTC to Guard/Reserve path. Congrats!
How’d the weekend go rushing the KC-135 squadron?
Glad to hear the medical consult went well. They do a great job.
Congrats again and welcome to BogiDope!
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@jd3 Welcome to BogiDope and congrats on your ENJJPT slot! This is dating myself, but I was actually in the first T-6 class at ENJJPT back in 2008. I’m sure a lot has changed, but I’m guessing that airplane is still a lot of fun to fly.
What seem to be the common drops recently at assignment night?
I’m sure there are a lot people interested in the active duty path and learning about the latest at ENJJPT as well, so any gouge you can provide the community woud be much appreciated. 🍻
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@A_Foster Welcome to BogiDope and congrats on the AFRC pilot slot! I think you might be the third person in this thread who has gone down that path from the AFROTC, so it appears it’s starting to grow in popularity.
Which AFRC fighter squadrons/airframes are you focusing on? Unfortunately, there aren’t as many fighter squadrons in AFRC as in the Guard, but they have some of the best locations (F-22s in AK and F-35s in UT if you like the mountains and F-16s/F-35s in FL and TX if you don’t like taxes!):
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@Duck Welcome to BogiDope! I’m guessing by “hiring events” you mean the job board? If you click on Military Jobs under the Job Board tab on the main menu, you’ll see a list of all Guard/Reserve pilot jobs submitted to MilRecruiter.com (where squadrons post jobs and collect applications). MilRecruiter and BogiDope auto sync every 24 hours, so anything posted by a squadron on MilRecruiter should show up on the BogiDope Job Board soon after.
If you were talking about something else, let me know and I’ll try to steer you in the right direction.
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@Chase Welcome to BogiDope! Being an engineer and fighter pilot in the Guard is totally doable, especially if your Guard unit is in the same city.
You will have to go on military leave from your job for approximately 4ish years as you go to flight school and complete your “seasoning days” back at the squadron that hired you (your civilian job will be protected this whole time). After that you’ll likely need about 8 sorties a month to stay current (drops to 6 sorties for most fighters after you’re deemed “experienced”). 8 sorties doesn’t necessarily mean 8 days of work per month (you can often get multiple sorties accomplished in one day).
Work as an engineer Mon-Thurs and then go fly jets every Friday (the best day in the squadron anyway) and one drill weekend. That should be doable schedule to keep both your civilian and military bosses only moderately frustrated with your availability.
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@Falcon First, the obvious question…is that really your middle name? There has to be a good story behind that. Do tell.
Congrats on the scholarship! That’s incredible. I’m sure there are tons of people on BogiDope that would be very interested to know how to get some of their flight training paid for, so if you have any info/lessons learned to pass on to the group, it would be much appreciated. Welcome!
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@Boseph Thanks for the additional info. Clearly this path is not well advertised yet, because you were told that you couldn’t go to the ANG, but here’s an article written by one of our previous clients who did just that: https://bogidope.com/the-ultimate-guide-to-earning-a-pilot-slot-in-air-force-rotc-part-2/.
Maybe starting that forum discussion you mentioned would be a good way of consolidating these nuggets of wisdom in one central place. Thanks again for offering to help and congrats again on getting selected!
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The Ultimate Guide to Earning a Pilot Slot in Air Force ROTC, Part 2 | BogiDope
Share In part one of this article series, we discussed what Air Force ROTC is and what it is like. This article will detail how…
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@Keebler we could certainly use some more voices for Naval Aviation around here, so any knowledge bombs you can drop are always welcome.
It sounds like you may need a couple of waivers for your commissioned service time (and age?) but definitely doable with the type of background/experience you have. We’re looking to working with you. Welcome to BogiDope!
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Hi Ben – In addition to maximizing your AFOQT scores, I would start getting as much flight time as you can. To convince a hiring board that “this time around will be different,” you’ll have to be able to display measurable improvements in areas that caused you to wash out (e.g. more aviation experience, academic achievement, etc). Good luck!
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@Dub-J It may be worth messaging @Boseph about the AFROTC pilot slots in the Guard/Reserve. He may have some useful insight.
Regarding your AFOQT scores, I would reach out to @Tutor-Gunboss about setting up some AFOQT tutoring. He has a some great tactics for maximizing your scores. Good luck!